His Holiness the Dalai Lama’s interview on PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT, CNN
Aired April 25, 2012 – 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
PIERS MORGAN, CNN HOST: Millions of people turn to him for spiritual guidance. Tonight my exclusive, in-depth interview with the Dalai Lama.
DALAI LAMA, EXILED TIBETAN SPIRITUAL LEADER: My honor is to describe myself as simple Buddhist monk. No more, no less. With the blessing of Buddha.
MORGAN: An extraordinary and surprising conversation with the Nobel Peace Prize winner.
Do you think the world is a more peaceful place now than it was when you first became Dalai Lama?
DALAI LAMA: Oh, yes.
MORGAN: Candid views on world leaders.
DALAI LAMA: I like President Bush.
MORGAN: Which one?
DALAI LAMA: The younger one.
MORGAN: Really?
DALAI LAMA: Really. His policies were not be very successful. But as a person, as a human being, very nice person. I love him.
MORGAN: His unexpected views on women.
Do you ever feel temptation when you see a woman?
DALAI LAMA: Oh, yes, sometimes. I think, this is very nice.
MORGAN: And a humorous side to the Dalai Lama you may have never seen before.
DALAI LAMA: I love your accent.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: British accent.
MORGAN: Thank you, Your Holiness. I like your accent. This is PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT.
The Dalai Lama, Tibet’s spiritual leader in exile. He’s one of the world’s most visible and honored holy man. He’s a Nobel Peace Prize winner and he’s in the U.S. for the 12th World Summit of Nobel Laureates. It’s my honor to welcome for an exclusive interview, His Holiness, the Dalai Lama.
Your Holiness, how are you?
DALAI LAMA: Fine.
MORGAN: We’re in the Mayo Clinic, you’ve had your annual check. Everything good?
DALAI LAMA: Everything good.
MORGAN: Everything healthy?
DALAI LAMA: Last now, almost seven years annually.
MORGAN: Yes?
DALAI LAMA: I got checked, yes. So physical condition remain more or less the same.
MORGAN: That’s good.
DALAI LAMA: Yes.
MORGAN: You are probably the most famous person I have ever interviewed. Do you like being that famous?
DALAI LAMA: No, no, no. I describe myself as a simple Buddhist monk. No more, no less. And I am one of the seven billion human being. Basically we are the same. You are British.
MORGAN: I’m British, yes.
DALAI LAMA: I’m Tibetan. These are (INAUDIBLE). Basically, your emotion, my emotion, your mind, my mind, your physical, of course, there are differences in the size of the nose.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: Basically, same physical. So I always look that way. We are the same. We are the same.
MORGAN: Do you think that fame is a corrupting force in the modern world? Celebrity?
DALAI LAMA: I think it depends on (INAUDIBLE), matters of attitude towards these sort of — some sort of popularity or some sort of good name. If you’re too much attached. Then sometimes you — that become hindrance or obstacle to realize one’s own weakness. So sometimes is that people originally very nice person, like most of the generation of people.
At the beginning, truly dedicated people. But then eventually power, this is (INAUDIBLE). So then sometimes become arrogant. And that, so more of the our practice one Tibetan lama, one thousand years ago, you see, he mentioned if you are becoming — if you find just more and more people respect you, then you must think to yourself the lowest person.
So that’s very important.
(CROSSTALK)
DALAI LAMA: I doesn’t matter other people say, now first of all, in my own case, some people say god. Nonsense. Some people say living Buddha. Nonsense. And also the other side, some people say, me, demon, that’s also nonsense.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: I’m simply a human being. Like that.
MORGAN: When I was very young, kids of my age, when I was sort of 8 or 9 years old, they wanted to be an astronaut, or, you know, a scientist or something like that. Today’s children, many of them in all the surveys, want to be celebrities. They don’t care how they get there. They just want to be celebrities.
And many people think that is damaging to modern society, that that is the new aspiration for young people.
DALAI LAMA: What is that word –
MORGAN: Celebrity.
DALAI LAMA: Celebrity. To be famous.
MORGAN: Yes.
DALAI LAMA: I think — and may I say so — most case, sports or singers or some dancers, that part, that kind, one category that way, so, another, I think really (INAUDIBLE), and some scientists, generally carry research, analyze, finding some new things on deep (INAUDIBLE), so I prefer this one, really thinking. Not just sort of external. Also think.
MORGAN: So you like famous people who are famous because they have done something serious, scientific?
DALAI LAMA: Yes.
MORGAN: Intelligent. Rather than perhaps more transitory, evacuous.
DALAI LAMA: But then I’d be late. Einstein, and some other, these are really, if they found some new things which is useful. Although sometimes there’s to much negative emotion. Then sometimes this new finding is utilized for destructive. That is sad. But the founder of these new things are great, not damaging. Not their fault.
MORGAN: We’re here to discuss the World Peace Summit that you’ve been asked to speak at. Do you feel the world is a more peaceful place now than it was when you first became Dalai Lama?
DALAI LAMA: Oh, yes. The fundamental level I think in today’s world much better. At least the disappearance of blood and war, and eventually big change happen. So at least the two blocs, both have their nuclear weapon ready to shoot each other. That kind of danger is now no longer. And some sort of violence, (INAUDIBLE), and some violence is very sad. But compare, during that previous danger, I think today I think comparatively, much better.
Then I think important. I think, although the word peace is something almost become fashion. Peace, peace, peace. Even though some people who are really making every preparation for war. But they use the word of peace, peace, peace.
MORGAN: When you see the Arab Spring uprisings through the Middle East, and you see so many countries having young people who are better educated, who are no longer prepared to put up with virtual dictatorships, and they rise up, are you supportive of their actions? Do you think that is good for the world that they do this?
DALAI LAMA: Yes, in principle, I support, of course. Obviously. I was always telling, expressing world belongs to humanity, humanity, not this leader, that leader, or the kings or queens or religious leaders. The world belongs to humanity. And then each country essentially belongs to their own people.
So in America, I often express America belongs to Americans, and I think 200 million American people, not the Republican Party or Democratic Party. So –
MORGAN: Do you think sometimes the politicians forget that?
DALAI LAMA: I don’t think generally politicians come from democratic country. I think not that thinking. But sometimes a little bit short sighted. They’re mainly looking for the next vote.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: That’s true.
DALAI LAMA: That is sort of the — a drawback. Otherwise, I don’t think. I don’t think. And so therefore, the best way to govern the country, by the people, is the Democratic way. There’s no question. No question. Therefore, my own case, I, the Dalai Lama, actually live formally ended almost four centuries old Tibetan tradition, head of the — also the political or temporal as well as spiritual. That I now ended. Because, you see, since my childhood, I — was impressed with the democratic system.
MORGAN: So you actually, you overthrew yourself.
DALAI LAMA: Oh, yes. (LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: Voluntarily. Admirably. Proudly. Well, I have one secret. Last year, the day I formally sort of handed it over, that night, unusual, deep sleep.
MORGAN: Really?
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: Yes. I’m very happy.
MORGAN: All the responsibility is gone.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Let’s take a short break.
DALAI LAMA: So, so, democratic system is better system. So these movement, principle, very good. Now I would like to take this opportunity, now take the (INAUDIBLE), basic goal, now time come, they must be united, all forces. No — no matter what their political thinking or something. Now they must work together. That’s very, very important. Mainly thinking about the economic condition and education, these things are most important. That I would like to — to say. I mean, I would like to take this opportunity.
MORGAN: Let’s take a short break, Your Holiness. When we come back, I want to pick you up on that same point. But I want to ask you about China and about America and about the forthcoming presidential election.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: I’m back with his Holiness, the Dalai Lama.
Let’s talk China for a moment. China has become, in your lifetime, arguably now one of the two great super powers of the world. And may economically in the next 10 or 15 years become the number one super power in the world.
What do you think of modern China and how it’s changed in the time that you’ve been Dalai Lama?
DALAI LAMA: Big change. China, most populated nation. And also long history. I think really, China, Chinese, I think they really have a long history of civilization, rich culture. (INAUDIBLE) they argue, is the richness of their food.
However, in modern China, a lot of ups and downs. But I have full faith Chinese people, they are hard working. So I think the last, I think 50 years, I think they already tested sort of the difference of experience. I think they, modern China, they got sort of really troubled experience during (INAUDIBLE) revolution.
So after (INAUDIBLE) revolution it seems they opened their eyes. So things are changing. Things, I think, very realistic person. Somehow life-long communists, dedicated person, so they very much sort of keep the political power. Now that also is now changing. Now president — prime minister quite often, several occasion including one I think he’s meeting with CNN, he mentioned China need political reform. So he seems to –
MORGAN: Are you pleased when you hear that?
DALAI LAMA: Oh, yes. Now, as I mentioned earlier, my fundamental belief is China belongs to one (INAUDIBLE) the Chinese people, not the communist party or (INAUDIBLE) party.
MORGAN: Is China’s power –
DALAI LAMA: So things are changing.
MORGAN: But is China’s new power good for Tibet, or is it dangerous for Tibet? Because the rest of the world may become so fearful of offending the Chinese, that they stop talking about Tibet.
DALAI LAMA: Yes, in some ways, yes, that’s right. But somehow, it’s a Tibet issue. Yes? It’s very much just an issue. And also involves more issue. So number of Chinese also now showing that sort of the sense of solidarity with us. And the world. Many parts of the world. And those who know something about Tibet, about its current situation. I think very, very sort of sympathetic. Sort of they are concerned. And the political including some business company, sometimes a little bit cautious.
MORGAN: How did you feel when President Obama delayed his meeting with you when he became president? Because the Chinese objected, and he met with them first. Did that offend you?
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: Did you understand why he did that?
DALAI LAMA: Actually, he said once (INAUDIBLE), something (INAUDIBLE) something, aside for me, explained the reason. There’s certain reason. So better. First his meeting, I think without some point with Chinese complaining. So better.
MORGAN: You understood that?
DALAI LAMA: Yes. And then soon after he returned, he want to see me.
MORGAN: And he gave you a 17-minute meeting. Which is the longest time, I believe, that any American president has ever spent with you in one meeting.
What did he say to you, President Obama? Did he give you assurances that he is going to help you?
DALAI LAMA: He inquired about Tibet. I obviously explain what is the current situation and our thinking. And he show sort of commitment to the Tibetan issue.
MORGAN: Does he show — does he share your vision, which is for a Tibet that has shared power between Tibet and China? Does he share that vision?
DALAI LAMA: Yes, sure. He (INAUDIBLE), what is our middle approach, not seeking separation, for all interest. I explain these things. Of course, he already knows. Then after our meeting, the White House formally some press sort of notice he made. Clearly he mentioned their support. That very, very good. Very good.
MORGAN: Activists –
DALAI LAMA: And then also my sort of meeting, the previous, Mr. Bush and Clinton, and eventually this senior or the father of — Mr. Bush’s father, that Bush, I met. He was very nice. Very nice. All very nice.
MORGAN: Since the start of 2011, activists say that over 30 Tibetans have self-immolated, obviously a very serious escalation in a number of people taking their lives in this way. As their holy leader, what do you feel about this? What do you say to people who are thinking of doing the same thing and why are more people doing this now?
DALAI LAMA: It’s — of course, it’s extremely sad, very sad. But this is not sort of the something new in China itself. I think in the cultural revolution, one important Chinese monastery’s abbot (ph) himself burned. And then Vietnam also you see it happen. And there are sort of cases there.
These are one way they believe non-violence. And then if things are desperate, then in sort of having other they simply to sacrifice their own life. So very sad. So now important thing is not solution that’s expressed, we are very sad. But we must think what’s cause of this so desperate situation.
MORGAN: And what do you think it is?
DALAI LAMA: That’s obvious.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: There are — I often used to telling, including some Chinese sort of friend, now time come the Chinese government must think seriously and then they must follow the regarding sort of policies, regarding minority, they must follow the policy as things have been stated second to the (inaudible) fact. So their policy must be realistic. They must accept the reality.
So then the things, once they know the reality and then process of policy according that reality, let’s release the policy.
MORGAN: Many of the — many of the Tibetans who are taking their lives are doing so because they want a free Tibet. That implies that they want separation from China, but that’s not what you want. DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: You think that’s achievable and you think that it’s better to have a shared power. So what do you say to these young Tibetans who are desperate for a free Tibet, who are chasing separation? Do you think it’s time that they were told –
DALAI LAMA: They’re not Tibetan. Some say, yes, they are sort of the — they have been sort of purpose, (INAUDIBLE). So some people say therefore that’s means independence. But many Tibetans feel, they say if they really want me, that they really trust me, then automatically they will sort of agree my view.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: So it is quite a contradiction. They want the Dalai Lama but they do not want the Lama’s idea. It is contradiction.
MORGAN: But that is a big problem, isn’t it?
DALAI LAMA: I don’t think, no, no. Well, of course, there is some people, they sit there, right from the beginning, they always say, oh, we want complete independence. But majority of the people not only here but also inside Tibet, last — few decades ,they say I had few occasion, collect their views, even recent Tibet.
Of course, not (INAUDIBLE), we cannot do. But from pocket buckets (ph). So most of the — most of the people, particularly more — more educated, more realistic thinking, they all fully support –
MORGAN: Do you believe –
(CROSSTALK)
MORGAN: Do you believe the new Chinese leadership are getting close to doing some kind of deal with Tibet or not? Do you believe that they are thinking the right way?
DALAI LAMA: Now, firstly, you see, they are — they are sort of policies regarding their own people, now things, you see, there are indications, the seriousness, see, these are indications they more moderate, more realistic thinking. They seems upper hand, of getting upper hand, but still too early to say.
So once the Chinese leaders, Communist leaders, they really thinking more realistically, then Tibet issue very easily can solve and also the issue of the whole people, sort of autonomy, and also in the Mongolia and rest of the China.
I think they are sort of — I always expressing 1.2 billion Chinese people have every right to know the reality. Once people know the reality, the 1.3 billion Chinese people also have the ability to judge what’s right or what’s wrong. Therefore, the censorship is immoral. Chinese people should know the reality. So censorship is really very, very –
(CROSSTALK)
MORGAN: If the censorship — if the censorship goes and the reality comes out, there is more chance of a deal?
DALAI LAMA: Certainly, 100 percent.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Let’s take a short break again, I want to come back and talk to you about America. I want you to tell the American people what you think of modern America and how to keep America great, because you’ve seen America for six decades, seven decades now? I’m interested in your view.
DALAI LAMA: America?
MORGAN: After this break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: I’m back again with the Dalai Lama.
Your Holiness, talk to me about America. What does America mean to you?
DALAI LAMA: Of course, the greatest modern country and I think a country, because of its democracy, the freedom, freedom of thought, freedom of speech, I think a lot of innovation, you see develop in this country. And then as a human being, American, more straightforward, very easily can talk, not like British.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Not like the Brits? Your Holiness. No need for that.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: English, a little bit –
MORGAN: Polite is the word you’re looking for.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Reserved.
DALAI LAMA: But one my sort of — sort of experience. First time visit Europe and then London, England, London, so one sort of reception after my talk on this issue, one English gentleman, very suddenly, sort of (INAUDIBLE) person and proposed to me then there is a meeting and expressed to me he really admire, you often say I don’t know.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: So then I felt, for English person, seems to see difficult trying to say I don’t know. (LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: That is true. That is — you’ll never hear me say that.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: OK, let’s get back to modern America. Clearly going through big problems at the moment, big economic problems, also examining itself as a country about its values, the American dream and how that has changed, many people out of work now, losing their homes and so on. What do you think of what has happened to America and how can it get itself back on track again?
DALAI LAMA: Yes. As I mentioned before, I — actually, is I asked the president and he assured me America, the fundamentals of its economic condition is sound. So the — I often, you see, express when I give some public talk that in any case America must succeed. This is democratic country, very powerful democratic country. It is not only American interest, but interest for the free world.
So I think American lifestyle maybe, I think should sort of — should be more realistic and think, there are some obstacles. There is no guarantee to go like that. That I think — and then after all they on global level seldom been human being, some of rich, some are very poor. Big sort of gap, rich and the poor.
MORGAN: Did too many Americans chase money as a beacon of success, do you think?
DALAI LAMA: Hmm?
MORGAN: Did too many Americans see money as a form of success? Is it a false dream, having a lot of money?
DALAI LAMA: There is that, not only America, but also in Europe. And also now Asia also is in money, it’s the top most important for value of our life. This is, I think, wrong. This is wrong. The money or physical — the material facility can provide only physical comfort, too physical comforts, some kind of mental satisfaction is actually false. Delusion. So the real peace of mind must come through sort of inner mental state, not money, not physical sort of comfort.
So that, I think, modern world, not only America, but modern world, even China and Russia. Now is it they much sort of talk. It was of money.
MORGAN: Who are the most impressive world leaders you’ve ever met in your life who have that heart element in them, who understand it?
DALAI LAMA: I think leaders have to act according to border sort of –
MORGAN: But who has impressed you? I mean, somebody like Nelson Mandela? I mean, which people that you’ve ever met have really impressed you?
DALAI LAMA: I think Nelson Mandela, I think what — are one of the sort of quite impressive. And then — then of course, as individual, individual person, I love President Bush.
MORGAN: Which one?
DALAI LAMA: The younger one.
MORGAN: Really?
DALAI LAMA: Yes. Really.
MORGAN: Why?
DALAI LAMA: As a human being.
MORGAN: Really?
DALAI LAMA: Not as president of America. Sometimes his policy may not be very successful, but as a person, as a human being, very nice person. I love him.
MORGAN: But how did you feel that President Bush went to war so much and was responsible for so –
(CROSSTALK)
MORGAN: If you’re a man of peace.
DALAI LAMA: After he sort of start the Iraq sort of crisis, then my occasional meeting with him, then I expressed with him, I love you, but your policies concerned, I have some reservation. I told him.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: What did he say?
DALAI LAMA: He couldn’t –
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Maybe you should’ve been in his cabinet.
Let’s take a short break. When we come back, I want to talk to you about you and your life.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: I’m back with His Holiness, the Dalai Lama.
Your Holiness, I want to get into your life and the kind of lifestyle that you lead because you’re a fascinating man in many ways. First of all, you were a vegetarian. But then you got bored with that and went back to meat. Is that right? DALAI LAMA: Yes, right. Of course, my early part of my life as in — under Tibetan, you see, our main diet non-vegetarian. Then after I came to India, 65, I give up eating meat and eggs and fish. Pure vegetarian. So, next, about 20 months, I remain that. Then some illness. The gallbladder, jaundice problem.
So, I — my sort of face become yellow. And nails and eyes become yellow. So later, I jokingly telling people, at that time, I truly become living Buddha.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: Yellow, yellow person.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: So I really making sort of — making effort to promote vegetarianism, but I myself remain non-vegetarian.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Let’s move on to other issues. As a monk, you obviously subscribe to a vow of celibacy.
DALAI LAMA: Yes.
MORGAN: Is that hard?
DALAI LAMA: No. If you just, you see, physically experience, then you sometimes — you may find a certain desire. But then whole picture — I often used to telling one occasion in England, some Buddhist monk. European Buddhist monk. I told them, when we watch the people who have family, sometimes I notice my first visit, another woman, another wife. Second visit, another woman, another wife. Previous wife, some children. Then another occasion, third, third wife.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: So, these, see, really, children suffer much when divorce, when parents divorce. And I told the married people, their mental state, their emotional state, too much ups and downs. Compare that with celibate people sort of mind more steady. So, long run, we have some advantage.
MORGAN: Do you ever feel temptation when you see a woman?
DALAI LAMA: Oh, yes, sometimes see people. Oh, this is very nice. But then thinking –thinking it’s a real job, then feel, too much problem –
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: Too much dirty things like that.
MORGAN: Really? DALAI LAMA: Really. Even my dream, this is some sort of — dreaming, some women like that. Image of the eye — I am monk. I never dreamt, in my dream, I’m Dalai Lama. I always remember, I am monk, always monk.
MORGAN: Do you ever drink alcohol?
DALAI LAMA: Never.
MORGAN: Have you ever smoked a cigarette?
DALAI LAMA: No. The Buddhist –
MORGAN: Ever taken a drug?
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: Nothing? Completely –
DALAI LAMA: Why?
MORGAN: I don’t know, I’m just asking.
DALAI LAMA: No, no, no, no.
MORGAN: I didn’t know the answers.
DALAI LAMA: I mean, drugs? If your mind, disturbances, unrest, then there’s not a choice, relying tranquilizers or drugs or alcohol. My mind, our mind, quite peaceful. So no need these things.
(CROSSTALK)
MORGAN: Have you always been peaceful?
DALAI LAMA: Then, then — wait, wait, wait. The wine, Tibetan wine, when I was very young, I think seven, eight years, very young. One night, one evening, late evening, I’m just playing, then one person, I see carrying two bottles. And I immediately run to him. And then my finger, put in the bottle. Very sweet.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: Then I asked that person, “Please, one bottle, put in my bedroom.”
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Well, I’m shocked, Your Holiness. What happened then? Did you drink it?
DALAI LAMA: Then — after my play, I return to my room, and there is the bottle. One bottle there. I touch just water.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: So my entourage (INAUDIBLE).
MORGAN: And you can still remember that bottle, don’t you? You wish you’d drunk it.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Do you watch television?
DALAI LAMA: Yes. In the past, (INAUDIBLE), two years, no.
MORGAN: What programs would you watch?
DALAI LAMA: Usually, like Discovery, and some sort of documentary film. It’s very good.
MORGAN: Did you ever watch entertainment programs?
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: You never watched “American Idol”?
DALAI LAMA: (Speaking in foreign language)
MORGAN: Simon Cowell? Do you know who Simon Cowell is?
DALAI LAMA: I don’t know.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: That’s the right answer. I like that.
Do you listen to music?
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: Not at all.
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: Really?
DALAI LAMA: Really.
MORGAN: No music at all?
DALAI LAMA: I have no interest.
MORGAN: Really?
DALAI LAMA: Yes.
MORGAN: Do you ever watch movies?
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: You’ve never seen a movie? DALAI LAMA: I saw movie, also the peace and war.
MORGAN: War and Peace?
DALAI LAMA: War and Peace.
MORGAN: Yes.
MORGAN: But Richard Gere is your good friend.
DALAI LAMA: Yes.
MORGAN: And you’ve never seen one of his movies?
DALAI LAMA: No.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Is he irritated that you’ve never seen one of his movies?
DALAI LAMA: I don’t know.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: So one final break. I’m fascinated about how you lead your life.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: I’m back again with the Dalai Lama.
Your Holiness, you’re on Twitter. You have four million followers on Twitter. That’s twice as many as me. I’m not happy about that.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: You’re twice as popular as me.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Do you ever actually — do you actually do the tweets? Do you?
DALAI LAMA: No, no, no. No, never.
MORGAN: Somebody does that for you.
DALAI LAMA: Yes.
MORGAN: They’re very good, I’ve been reading them.
DALAI LAMA: My finger is quite well-equipped. The — also the –
MORGAN: Yes, you usually — you wanted to be an engineer, I know.
(CROSSTALK)
DALAI LAMA: The computer, these things, my finger not so –
MORGAN: Do you ever use a computer?
DALAI LAMA: No.
MORGAN: Do you ever send an e-mail?
DALAI LAMA: No. I’ll ask something — someone.
MORGAN: Have you ever used a cell phone?
DALAI LAMA: No. Occasionally, someone — might talk with someone, including Bush.
MORGAN: So if a president calls, you’ll use a cell phone.
DALAI LAMA: Yes. Then –
(CROSSTALK)
MORGAN: Pretty exclusive –
DALAI LAMA: I’ve had, you see, when I talk, that should be here. When I listen, should be here. Then someone told me, not necessary.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: They warned me before that if you sit back in your chair, like this, it means that you’ve lost interest in the interview. I’ve been very pleased that you’ve spent most of the interview leaning forward.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: That means you must have enjoyed it.
DALAI LAMA: Your sort of interview, not just because it was something, some discussion without feeling, seems you are talking with certain feeling. Then I love your accent.
(LAUGHTER)
DALAI LAMA: British accent.
MORGAN: Thank you, Your Holiness. I like your accent.
(LAUGHTER)
MORGAN: Let me ask you, finally, you’ve had an amazing life and long may it continue. What has been the greatest moment of your life. If I could replay one moment for you, what would it be?
DALAI LAMA: I can literally, immediately after my final examination, that was 1959. (INAUDIBLE), Happy.
MORGAN: To become Dalai Lama.
DALAI LAMA: No, no, no. Final examination for my degree.
MORGAN: Right.
DALAI LAMA: For studying.
MORGAN: Right. DALAI LAMA: Then, then perhaps, the — 18th morning, March ’59, 17th night, I left, I escaped from (INAUDIBLE). On 18th morning, I already reached some distance, now free, Chinese soldier. So two minutes of feeling sort of — I said, firstly, now no longer, immediate danger. Still danger, still there. But then, mainly, freedom of speech.
Then my mother and sister, you see, gathered, afternoon, 18th. Then my — including my mother. Now freely criticize about Chinese. Before that, we’re a little bit sort of cautious.
MORGAN: You were free at last. You were free at last.
DALAI LAMA: I think — at least I think several I think thousand people should get some benefit out of — many occasion. Some writing, through writing, or through personal meeting. Number of people have said to me, after hearing your thinking, their mind becomes much more happier.
MORGAN: Well, I can tell you, Your Holiness, that I feel happier than I did one hour ago. And that is down to you. It’s been a fascinating hour. Thank you very much, indeed.
DALAI LAMA: And so –
MORGAN: I really appreciate it.
DALAI LAMA: Thank you. So, you see there is some — and then religious harmony is concerned, I’ve made some contribution.
MORGAN: You did. You have.
(CROSSTALK)
DALAI LAMA: When I reflect these things, then I feel sort of deeper satisfaction.
MORGAN: Your Holiness, thank you very much. It’s been such a pleasure.
DALAI LAMA: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
MORGAN: Thank you very much.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MORGAN: Tonight’s “Only in America,” some inspiration from the remarkable man I’ve just interviewed.
American spend $11 billion a year on self-help from books and yoga classes, to a treat of Botox and god knows what else. The Dalai Lama, however, provides a rather cheaper way of finding happiness. And here it is. In the great man’s own words, this seven-point guide to self-fulfillment.
One, the practice of love can be expressed in one sentence. Do not harm others. Two, a true hero is one who conquers his own anger and hatred. Three, the point of our existence is that as human beings we live purposeful and meaningful lives. Fourth, if you want spiritual development, the practice of patience is essential.
Five, we have the ability and the responsibility to choose whether our actions follow a virtuous path or not. Six, with inner strength for mental stability, we can endure all kinds of adversity. Seven, love, compassion, and concern for others are real sources of happiness.
Admit it. You feel better already.
That’s all for us tonight. “AC 360″ starts now.
